MARY LOUISE KELLY, HOST:
If you, like me, are ready for a hefty dose of Black comedy, may I invite you to catch up with the Garvey sisters?
(SOUNDBITE OF TV SHOW, "BAD SISTERS")
SHARON HORGAN: (As Eva Garvey) Where the hell's Becka?
SARAH GREENE: (As Bibi Garvey, shouting) Becka...
HORGAN: (As Eva Garvey) Jesus Christ.
GREENE: (As Bibi Garvey, shouting) ...Get up, you lazy cow.
KELLY: We met them two years ago, when the TV show "Bad Sisters" made its debut. It revolved around the antics of four sisters in Ireland who are hell-bent on murdering the husband of the fifth sister. And believe me when I tell you, he had it coming. The show was wicked. It was deliciously dark, packed with banter and secrets.
Season 2 picks up there, with the notion that - as Sharon Horgan, who created and stars in "Bad Sisters" puts it - you don't just kill a man and move on. Sharon Horgan, welcome.
HORGAN: Hi.
KELLY: Hi.
HORGAN: Thanks for having me.
KELLY: Set the stage for us for what is happening with the Garvey sisters as the second season takes off. We're focused on Grace. She is the sister whose husband did indeed die in the first season.
HORGAN: He did die. That's putting it very politely. Thank you. Yeah, it's two years on from that. And, you know, we join the sisters when they are getting on with their lives as best they can, but the sort of aftershock of what happened is still very much with them. Grace is getting married and...
KELLY: Yeah, she's found new love. She looks so beautiful...
HORGAN: She has found new love.
KELLY: She's all made up. She's happy, and then...
HORGAN: She's happy.
KELLY: ...(Laughter) You give it, like, 10 minutes before it all falls apart.
HORGAN: Well, that's it. We kind of concocted a group of things to happen that would sort of provide the perfect storm for someone who's so fragile and vulnerable anyway. I mean, we left the first season with her sort of jumping into the water, and she sort of found her freedom and moved on. But like I said, you don't, really. And it was a lovely sort of fairytale ending. But at the same time, life isn't like that, and I'm just delighted we got a chance to, you know, go further with this story. It's about this, you know, sisterhood that comes together and sort of battles to protect each other.
KELLY: What you just described - the bond among these sisters - it is the organizing force of the show. And yet, another thing you do in this new season is introduce the notion that they aren't quite sure if they can trust each other. At one point, one of the sisters, Bibi, says, I'm thinking things I don't want to be thinking about my sister.
HORGAN: Absolutely.
KELLY: What was that like to write? Tell me.
HORGAN: Well, I mean, it was really interesting, actually, and it was something that, when we were mid-production on the first season, we realized, you know, could be something kind of tantalizing in a way - the sort of isolation that someone like Grace finds herself in. And so we felt that there was a huge amount of secrets there that we could explore...
KELLY: Yeah.
HORGAN: ...And sort of blow open. But the idea of them sort of questioning Grace and her actions was an absolutely horrible thing, actually. It was horrible to write and sort of upsetting. And the scene when Grace sort of realizes that that's what they're saying - because she has held things too close to her chest and because she hasn't let them in - it just felt like a dangerous but very interesting, deep area to explore.
KELLY: Ah. You introduce a new character in this season - a nosy, sneaky, busybody named Angelica, played by the great Fiona Shaw. What's she bringing to the show?
HORGAN: Oh, my God. What isn't she bringing?
KELLY: (Laughter).
HORGAN: She is a delight. We're all obsessed with her. You know, I wanted to introduce someone who sort of begins to upturn the apple cart and someone who's just slightly generationally removed. And also, geographically, she's a Northern Irish woman. And I think, you know, for a woman of her generation, at that time, in that part of Ireland, it was kind of more difficult to have a career or to have independence, and she's sort of limited in a lot of ways. And, you know, it was very interesting to have a character like that sort of look at the Garveys with their freedom, with their bodies, and with their - you know, their language, and sort of think, that can't be right, but also someone who's just, like, looking for human connection, you know? So she's a massive contradiction. She's a hurt person who wants to hurt, and...
KELLY: She is just the definition of passive-aggressive and up in your business.
HORGAN: (Laughter) Yeah.
KELLY: She's like...
HORGAN: Yes.
KELLY: ...Handing you a chocolate while stabbing you in the back.
HORGAN: (Laughter) That's it. Patting you on your head and giving you a biscuit while ruining your life.
KELLY: (Laughter).
HORGAN: No, she was an absolute joy. I mean, I can't tell you. There was times when we - she would do a take, and we would just break into applause because we were, you know, so riveted to everything she did. She was an absolute joy.
KELLY: It's fair to say this season is really dark. Characters die who I really didn't want to die. But there were moments - many - when I was laughing out loud. There's one where your character, Eva, introduces her menopause coach.
(SOUNDBITE OF TV SHOW, "BAD SISTERS")
FIONA SHAW: (As Angelica Collins) How are you blessed to know this family, Eileen?
JUSTINE MITCHELL: (As Eileen Ryan) Through Eva. We've been working together. I'm her menopause coach.
SHAW: (As Angelica Collins) Menopause coach? (Laughter) Is that real?
KELLY: Like, is that a thing? Is that real?
HORGAN: People are so obsessed with this. It's making me laugh.
KELLY: (Laughter).
HORGAN: You know, a lot of me went into Eva this time round. Like myself at that particular time, she starts getting fit. She decides to throw a bit of her disposable income at, like, sorting her hormones out. And I had started, you know, seeing a lady online - not what I would call a menopause coach, but they do exist. And, you know, I thought I need to get Eva in this great place for - or at least a place of, you know, improvement and working her life out, and...
KELLY: ...Looking after herself. Yeah.
HORGAN: Exactly - before I absolutely ruin her life (laughter).
KELLY: (Laughter) Plus, it gave you an excuse to get a trainer in real life, I guess...
HORGAN: Well, there you go.
KELLY: ...As preparation. There you go.
HORGAN: Yeah. Yeah.
KELLY: Did it feel risky, though - menopause humor? Did you worry whether anyone besides, I don't know, me - fellow middle-aged woman - whether we would laugh?
HORGAN: No, not at all. I didn't, really. And in fact, I think if you think too deeply about what specific audience members are going to be liking or disliking, then you're sort of - you're heading for a fall kind of thing. You know, you have to write what's interesting to you and what you hope is going to appeal. But at the same time, it just has to always be about the story, and it has to be about the characters.
KELLY: That's such good advice for so many things. Like, you can't worry about whether this is going to be a crowd-pleaser or not. If I find this...
HORGAN: Yeah.
KELLY: ...Funny, the rest of you should get on board.
HORGAN: Well, that's it. You know, I mean, saying that, I felt a responsibility because people were so lovely about the first season - and particularly women getting in touch and women who've been in those terrible relationships and felt seen - I didn't want to mess it up. Then that's down to me to just, you know, work hard to make sure the story goes places that is both, you know, unexpected but also truthful, you know? So that's all I can do, and then cross my fingers. Cross everything.
KELLY: Cross everything.
HORGAN: (Laughter).
KELLY: Thank you so much. This has been an absolute delight.
HORGAN: Oh, thank you so much for having me.
KELLY: Sharon Horgan - she is the creator and star of "Bad Sisters," which you can find on Apple TV+.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "WHO BY FIRE")
PJ HARVEY: (Singing) And who in her lonely slip, who by barbiturate, who in these realms of love. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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