AILSA CHANG, HOST:
One of the bedrocks of American democracy is the role of the U.S. military, which is why it may have stunned the nation to see that some 15% of those federally charged for the January 6 assault on the Capitol had military ties. But for many who served, this is also a time to encourage civic participation and push back on conspiracy theories around elections. We wanted to talk about those efforts. And here to help us are NPR's Odette Yousef and Quil Lawrence. Hello to both of you.
ODETTE YOUSEF, BYLINE: Hey, Ailsa.
QUIL LAWRENCE, BYLINE: Hi.
CHANG: OK, Quil, I want to start with you because you sat down with a group of vets this week at a Pints and Patriotism event. Am I right? What is that? And tell us more.
LAWRENCE: I was at a brewery called Tranquility Brewing in Bucks County, Pennsylvania, and I was willing to make that sacrifice to go to a brewery...
CHANG: Thank you.
LAWRENCE: ...Where dozens of veterans were getting together to drink beer and chat. And it was convened by Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America, IAVA. And Allison Jaslow was a combat vet. She runs IAVA, and she opened up the discussion.
ALLISON JASLOW: Now, whether you served in wartime or not, I think people who served in the U.S. military have had to prove over and over again that they put country before themselves. That doesn't mean that they always agree, but they know how to do it. You know, I think - can allow veterans to lead by example at a time when American needs us most.
LAWRENCE: And they passed the mic around. They've done these events in Arizona, Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, and they're civil, and they're friendly, though it's very clear there are people in the crowd who are voting for different presidential candidates. The other group sponsoring the chats is called Democracy First, and it's committed to supporting the electoral process, respectful discourse and a peaceful transfer of power.
CHANG: Well, Odette, we saw on January 6, some of the people trying to interrupt the peaceful transfer of power were themselves veterans, right? What are you hearing this election cycle from other veterans trying to counter that activity this time around?
YOUSEF: Yeah, I spoke with Kristofer Goldsmith, who's a veteran and who's started a group that exposes the activities of extremist groups. They do this by infiltrating them online. It's called the Task Force Butler Institute. And this time, Ailsa, they've been scaling up their capacity, training more vets to do that research in the run-up to the election.
KRISTOFER GOLDSMITH: We want to be ready for the next January 6 type of event. So what we're doing is helping people understand what threats are on the horizon from extremists and also what threats are on the horizon from politicians who are embracing extremist violence.
YOUSEF: And you'll remember, Ailsa, that leading up to January 6, a lot of people that were doing that kind of open-source intelligence gathering knew that militia-type groups were planning violence because they were planning it openly on social media.
CHANG: Right.
YOUSEF: And so that's what these vets are looking out for. And Goldsmith is also working with other groups that are planning offline mobilizations of veterans during this cycle.
CHANG: Wait, offline mobilizations? What does that mean?
YOUSEF: So one of the groups doing this is called Common Defense. It's a national progressive grassroots network of veterans. They have been assembling teams to deploy to locations where crises might unfold. You know, these would be unarmed vets training in de-escalation techniques. And for instance, you know, if they're hearing that, say, an angry armed mob of people are gathering at a vote tallying location, they might send a team there. Perry O'Brien is a veteran and co-founder of Common Defense.
PERRY O'BRIEN: We want to mobilize vets to be visible, to be out and to help restore a sense of safety to folks because a thing that we've heard very consistently is, like, having vets who are, you know, visibly veterans - you know, wearing hats like this and showing up - helps people feel more secure.
CHANG: OK, so you've got veterans who have participated in extremist groups, and you've got vets forming teams to counter those extremists. So Quil, I mean, were you seeing this kind of polarization just in the conversations at that Pints and Patriotism event in Pennsylvania?
LAWRENCE: In some ways, it was just sort of a typical conversation. I mean, vets are like anyone else, really. They've got a gamut of opinions, and the way they vote more often lines up with their age, race and their gender than necessarily their veteran status. But there were a bunch of references to service and to veterans issues, and folks just seemed to be glad to be there. We can listen to Patricia Crossly speaking. She's the wife of a veteran and has family who served in recent wars, and she and her husband disagree about how to vote.
PATRICIA CROSSLY: We have different political views. We are voting for different people this election. And I said when we got here, I'm picking the spot next to the door so that I could leave.
UNIDENTIFIED PERSON: (Laughter).
CROSSLY: I just want to say thank you because I had no idea what I was expecting.
LAWRENCE: I mean, she and many others were just very grateful to have this safe space for a civil conversation, and that's what it was, and it was great. But it was kind of striking to me that we're at a point where it is so remarkable and rare that you can find a safe space for a civil conversation.
CHANG: So true. That is NPR's Quil Lawrence and Odette Yousef. Thank you to both of you.
YOUSEF: Thank you.
LAWRENCE: Thanks. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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